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court, driving offences

PostPosted: Mon Aug 17, 2009 3:10 pm
by freeredcaz
Hi, I would appreciate any help and advice on my case. Please feel free to ask any questions as I am only sketching an outline on what happened.

I have some charges against me that will be at lewes magistrates court in sussex at the end of next week. When I was taken by the police I did not have my crib sheet or phone on me and although I tried to act the correct way, I was working on memory and was also extremely intimidated and nervousm and I am not sure if I did things correctly/This is what happened:

I was stopped as I walked into my friends house, as I had been flagged as having expired MOT and insurance. The police officer said he smelt alcohol on my breath and marched me back to his car. I had alredy asked if I had breached the peace or had a complaint against me and did not co-operate beyond that. I neither answered their questions as to who I was nor would I consent to give a sample of breath. Although I should have been ok on the breath sample should have been ok, I did not want to enter into contract and I dont have mot or insurance. I was taken to the police station. On the way I asked the younger officer if he was acting as /o r was a peace officer. He said no (on camera). At the station I answered no questions nor acknowledged the officers, other than to state that I did not consent and that as far as I was concerned: as I have not breached the peace or had a complaint made against me, and therefore that I had been kidnapped and held against my will. I gave my name given name and of '...' family. Unfortunately I had d/l id with me but I never admitted to being attached to that name. I again did not acknowledge the police officer when asked for a further sample and was then locked up. Through all this I was ridiculed by all the desk sergeants and other officers. My bigest fear was that they were going to section me under the mental health act as they made it clear that they thought I was mad. I was finally realesed the next day, having had my photo and f/prints taken, and was charged with 2 failures to provide specimens of breath and no mot and insurance. I signed for the papers, photos and f/prints with a cross as I was worried about not being released and maybe being sectioned. I have a summoins to appear in a week and a half. Obviously this is not enough time for me to prepare or to see if this is something I could win. I am pretty sure that they could lock me up for these charges they have made so I have to get it right. I am also not sure if I may have inadvertently given consent at some time whilst at the station. Does anyone know a way I can get a defferal. If I plead not guilty and the judge sees what I have said at the station I believe the judge may throw the book at me.


Re: court, driving offences

PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 6:05 pm
by elemental mechanic
you might want to scan v's book with regard to making an apperance at court, altough i would recommend you trough (cram) all the book asap. perhaps it would also be an idea to have a look through the postings on motoring issues for other members who i'm sure would have walked the route you are heading. also perhaps after you have digested v's book have a look on the templates postings. in my opinion carl, if you believe you are guilty for what you have done and behave as such then maybe you are. (i hope you follow where i'm coming from)

i'm sure other members will have some good pointers.
all the best on this one

peace is :love:


Re: court, driving offences

PostPosted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 7:40 pm
by Phil: C
Hi Carl,
freeredcaz wrote:The police officer ... marched me back to his car.

How exactly did he march you? Did he pull or push you? Had you been arrested at this point? If not, that would be assault surely? I have no knowledge about or experience of this kind of situation, but could you make a counter-claim or a complaint? This might have the effect of deferring the hearing and give you more time to prepare.
Just my six pennorth - I'm sure others with more knowledge will respond.

Best wishes and good luck.

Phil C.

Re: court, driving offences

PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 6:34 pm
by freeredcaz
Thank you Phil C and elementalmechanic for replying. I am not sure where to go at this point. It is really my own fault that I was/am unprepared; as they say - a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. Do I think I am guilty? Well, I am for acting as if I had it all in place when I didn't. However, by the same token I caused no harm to anyone, nor did I breach the peace. There were no complaints made against me. Should I be driving with no mot and insurance? That was a responsibility I chose to take. Like most bike riders, I am aware that the most likely victim is me. I live in the middle of nowhere and traffic is very sparse.
Phil , thank you for highlighting me being 'marched to their car' ; one of the reasons my back got up was that the first thing the policy officer did was physically assault me, this despite the fact I had acted peacefully.
To be honest, I am not adverse to losing my licence etc. It would be inconvenient, obviously. However, had I acted within their rules, I would probably just be looking at some points. But, as I stated, I was not confident in myself and did not act (properly) like (I was) a freeman and so, elementalmechanic, I am afraid you are probably right: as it stands at the moment, I shall have to swallow that bitter pill and learn from this experience.
As it stands I do not feel competent enough to stand my ground, but this may change in the coming week. As they say: lose the battle, win the war!

Thank you both again for taking the time to answer my query, your words have been a comfort and support for me.

Namaste; peace to you and all of us on this path of awakening


Re: court, driving offences

PostPosted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 1:45 pm
by freeredcaz
Well, having spent quite a lot of time reading and researching along with advice from others, I may well be contesting and attempting to go down the common law route. My biggest concern is not being ready. Could anyone please answer these questions?

Is the first appearance in a magistrates court a hearing?

If it is, am I obliged to enter a plea, whether as sovereign acting as person, or being person?

Is the magistrates court under common law jurisdiction?

Also does anyone know where I can find a template for Amicus Curaie?

My thoughts at the moment are to send one of VIctoria's templates for summons, and then appear as representative, as they will not have had time to reply (court this week). I am hoping this might make them reschedule. On this template though it states that I received paperwork at my address when in actuality it was handed to me. Will this affect it?

Any input would be appreciated. I am sory if my questions seem a little disjointed and maybe not specific enough, but this is my first attempt and I want to cover all bases. Also, I am sure that most of this information is available somewhere but I have limited internet access and there is so, so much to learn and discover.


Re: court, driving offences

PostPosted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:05 pm
by MikeThomas
In a Magistrates court they are all hearings, not trials. Not that this means much to Magistrates

Are you obliged to come round my place and wash my car? As far as I'm concerned you are not obligated to do so.

No, a Magistrates Court does not acknowledge Common Law unless they're made to.

Amicus curiae or amicus curiƦ (plural amici curiae) is a legal Latin phrase, literally translated as "friend of the court", that refers to someone, not a party to a case, who volunteers to offer information on a point of law or some other aspect of the case to assist the court in deciding a matter before it. The information may be a legal opinion in the form of a brief, a testimony that has not been solicited by any of the parties, or a learned treatise on a matter that bears on the case. The decision whether to admit the information lies with the discretion of the court.

Check out Soulwaves posts here: viewtopic.php?f=76&t=2254 and here: viewtopic.php?f=76&t=2134

Some great stuff that might be useful to you.
Good luck mate.

Re: court, driving offences

PostPosted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:32 pm
by freeredcaz
Thanks Mark, I am just d/loading these now to peruse when I get home (am using city centre internet and battery running flat). I will be printing off the summons letter and delivering one by hand and the other will be sent by recorded post. If it is a hearing, can I presume that they will not be able to sentence me (i.e. prison) at that hearing, as this would, at least, enable me to get a) my affairs in order; and b) continue my freeman route i.e. NOU etc ?

That would be a relief in itself. There is nothing worse than being unprepared and I certainly feel that, although I am able to stand my ground. I would just be a lot happier when I have a bond etc.


Re: court, driving offences

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 8:57 am
by freeredcaz
One last thing, can anyone helpme with this:

As I was bailed to appear at the magistrates court, how can I fulfill my bail obligations and thus not be arrested for that offence and remanded in custody, and still remain a third party intervener or agent of my person? I was about to send off my request for clarification letter but I am unsure about this. I don't want to appear sloppy and unknowledgeable before the hearing. Also, if anyone is free to help me at the court in any capacity, please pm me. I am appearing on Thursday at Lewes magistrates.


Re: court, driving offences

PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 9:17 am
by freeredcaz
So, I had got myself all prepared, learning how to stay sovereign in the courthouse, psyched myself up, dressed and ready to go. Checked through my summons papers and realised - OMG, I was meant to be there yesterday. What a numpty. I have called the court but they redirect everything to Brighton Magistrates. Called them and they have said they will not get the court papers till this afternoon. I have asked them to take a note of my call. Now I am well and truly buggered.
It seems I will have to hand myself in, then if I don't plead or plead not guilty they will probably remand me, as I failed to appear before. I am not really sure what to do.GOd, what a mess I made of it. My only hope is that it was adjourned prior to that, but that seems unlikely. I am really unsure what to do next, I feel such an idiot. All that preparation messed up. I don't suppose any one has any ideas or has been in a similar situation?

Re: court, driving offences

PostPosted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 9:55 am
by Farmer
If all else fails, when in court demand to question the injured party.