A method to register but retain ownership

[the worm that turned]

I have come up with a method that might allow for the registration of the birth of a child but retain total ownership as the natural parents to any title, or legal fiction.

I have created an affidavit that has been duly witnessed and sworn in front of a solicitor. The next stage is knowing WHO TO SERVE THIS AFFIDAVIT TO.

Any advice on here would be very kindly appreciated as I need to serve it to the relevant people before Fri 17 April.

Many thanks TWTT

[jonboy]

I would suggest the General registry office if you really feel compelled to register.

[the worm that turned]

I don't feel compelled to register but I have my wife's wishes to consider too. So you are suggesting that I send a copy of my affidavit to the GRO in London? I would tend to agree with you and I will be showing it to the Sub-District Registrar before they fill in their book at the local office.

Can you think of anyone else it needs to go to to make the affidavit MORE legally or lawfully binding. My understanding is that once written and sworn in front of a solicitor it forms part of common law, however the solicitor said that affidavits are "normally" only used in court (appended to the court documentation) and that it "probably" wouldn't be of any use.

Can and does a document need to be seen in court to be legally binding?? I don't think it does, and so long as the relevant people have seen the affidavit (i.e. those that it effects) then why should it need to be seen in a court? Once I have successfully registered following presentation of the affidavit to the GRO etc. then I will be sharing the contents on here and elsewhere.

It is my intention to follow it up with a Notice of Understanding and Intent and Claim of Right, which directly relates to the Affidavit. Could be a way forward for this confusing, cloak and dagger, smoke and mirrors system we are trying to understand.

[jonboy]

Could you paste the affidavit up here?

[Veronica]

Can and does a document need to be seen in court to be legally binding?? I don't think it does, and so long as the relevant people have seen the affidavit (i.e. those that it effects) then why should it need to be seen in a court? Once I have successfully registered following presentation of the affidavit to the GRO etc. then I will be sharing the contents on here and elsewhere.

Not "legally binding! ... "LAWFULLY binding". A contract that is made out containing full disclosure, equal consideration, lawful terms & conditions and two wet signatures is LAWFULLY binding. This only ever gets into a court if one party breaks the contract. Contracts are being made all the time. They are lawfully binding but never reach a court because both parties continue to honour the agreements made.

If anything is actually brought into a court, then the first thing that happens is it is determined whether or not it is lawful (aka lawfully binding) and - if so - then who is right, who is wrong ... and who pays what as a penalty.

In summary a document is lawful if it meets the terms of the law. You can post it - as a notice - to anyone you choose. That way they can see you are acting lawfully, and you are letting them know that any court action against you will fail. That way it would only get as far as a court if they are too stupid to realise that you will win hands down.

At the time of writing quite a number of members of this Forum, and some non-members, have sent off lawfully-binding documents in response to 'official demands', and so on. This has been happening since February. To the best of my knowledge - at the time of writing - no-one has actually been physically taken to court ... although many, many, threats have been made.

That's not strictly true. In one case a summons had been issued and it only came to my attention with about 7 days to go before the Hearing. We created a letter, and it was hand-delivered. We decided that it would be best to actually go to the Hearing. On the day, outside the court, the Defendant spoke to a clerk, and drew her attention to the letter. She disappeared - came back - and said "They've adjourned this for a month".

Two days later he got a letter informing him of the new time/date for the Hearing.

A day later he got another letter, from the clerk, saying the case had been dropped and that he would hear no more about it.

However I should point out that he would have won anyway, because he was on Housing Benefit and was charged with not paying Council Tax. (Council Tax Benefit is automatic from Housing Benefit). THIS POINT WAS DELIBERATELY - NOT - MENTIONED IN HIS LETTERS. So what actually happened was that his letter focussed their attention to review the situation ... AND THEY DISCOVERED THIS for themselves ... and probably breathed a huge sigh of relief. That was our impression.

(One of our problems is that 'things go cold'. They breathe fire & brimstone and then, after putting them on notice, the whole thing goes cold. It takes quite a length of time - maybe six months - before you get the idea that they've given up ... because they will rarely ever tell you)

[the worm that turned]

Could you paste the affidavit up here?

I will post on here once I have presented it to the Registrar and sent recorded delivery to the Registrar General, plus copies to the applicable departments on Direct.gov (e.g. DVLA,HMRC etc).

Are there any legal offices I should consider - I spoke to Judiciary Office but they weren't interested...

[the worm that turned]

Following several requests here is the affidavit I created. This is merely for entertainment purposes as it is something I constructed myself for my own use and I am in no way whatsoever suggesting it should be used by any other man or woman. Any use of its content is entirely down to that individual and I accept no responsibility for its use whether partial or in full by any other.

Affidavit of (name)

I (name) of (address), (occupation)

MAKE OATH and say as follows:

On the (day) of (month) in the year (year) I witnessed my (son/daughter) being born at the (Hospital) in (address of hospital).
My wife and I have named our (son/daughter) (first name only) and (he/she) is a free man on this land.
As the natural parents of (first name), I and my wife, (wife’s name), are the lawful guardians and take full and total responsibility and ownership for (him/her) until (he/she) reaches an age where (he/she) is capable of taking full and total responsibility and ownership for (himself/herself), as deemed by the Common Law of England, or as deemed by myself or my wife.
In the instance that any man, person, body incorporate, body corporate, company or any other entity whatsoever attempts to classify or give title to our (son/daughter), such as but not limited to creating the title of a person (“person”), which may or may not also be known as the term “legal fiction” and which may or may not be included or requested in any statute, legislation or regulation, using any names or titles such as but not limited to (different versions of name in capitals etc.), and with or without the prefix Mister, Mr, Master, Mstr, Doctor or Dr, then I, as the father, natural parent and lawful guardian of (first name), claim full and total ownership and control of any such title, person or legal fiction created in (his/her) name until (he/she) reaches an age where (he/she) is capable of taking responsibility for (himself/herself), as deemed by the Common Law of England, or as deemed by me or my wife, at which time full and total ownership and control will pass to the (man/woman) (first name) of the family (family name).
If I should die before the (day) day of (month) in the year (year 18 years on from year of birth) then the full and total ownership of any title, person or legal fiction created in the name of my (son/daughter), (first name) of the family (family name), will pass to my wife, (wife’s name), until our (son/daughter), (first name), reaches an age where (he/she) is capable of taking responsibility for (himself/herself), as deemed by the Common Law of England, or as deemed by my wife, at which time full and total ownership and control will pass to the (man/woman) (first name) of the family (family name). If both I and my wife should die before the (day) day of (month) in the year (year 18 years on from year of birth) then any (man/woman) named as the lawful guardian in our last Will and Testament will become the full and total owner of any title, person or legal fiction that may or may not have been created in the name of our (son/daughter), (first name), until (he/she) reaches an age where (he/she) is capable of taking responsibility and ownership for (himself/herself), as deemed by the Common Law of England, or as deemed by any (man/woman) named as the lawful guardian in our last Will and Testament, at which time full and total ownership and control will pass to the (man/woman) (first name) of the family (family name).
This affidavit is binding in common law and is hereby actioned.



____________________________________
Signature

SWORN AT (address)
this day of year
before me,

____________________________________
(A Solicitor or Commissioner for Oaths)

[Zacoustica]

Hi, how have you gone with your affidavit? Any progress? Cheers

[retlaw]

in the usa if you want to register personal property you do a UCC (uniform commercial code)
in canada it is called a PPSA (personal property security act)
if you MUST register a birth, why not register it as personal property,(biological investment)
that way you are not breaking the law and you are not volunteering a surity,
do the laws state in england where you have to register the birth? or just you have to register?

[Cbdanine]

Has anyone looked into whether or not you could create a N.U.I.C.OR for yourself, that also includes the government not having rights over anything you produce, i.e. children?