Allodial Title is Real

Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby huntingross » Thu Jul 16, 2009 10:07 pm

I can argue the relevancy of the human rights act better than most....the case is watertight....where is the public interest greater than my rights in the case of planning in a remote field...or where is the National imperitative....chances are it will get punted out....ours was.

The only human rights cases you see winning are criminals....they have more human rights and access to them than we do.

As for the farmers field, you live on a croft....they're wrapped in law and steeped in history....that doesn't surprise me in the slightest....they are their own planning niche.

I've never used the word 'true' in the context of allodial, my reading of anything I can find on the subject suggests the title dissolves with secured debt and therefore by definition, burden.

It follows...allodial is in-a-lien-able....therefore if it has lien it can't be allodial
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Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby flora » Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:02 am

naw, i'm no convinced from a legal standpoint that it is true allodial title in scotland. I mean if you look at the abolition of feudal tenure act it does not relinguish all burdens including mineral rights. I know farmers and crofters in just about every county in the highlands and only one of them has mineral rights. I'm not saying that true allodial title cannot be established by relinguishing any burdens through a notice of intent and claim of right to say the owner of the mineral rights maybe. Besides you can be for sure that they abolished feudal tenure only for their own benefit, not ours. I will keep looking into it though. Aye, crofting is its own planning niche. It is easier to get planning permission on croft land than on any other land in the entire uk. Fact. This is the beauty of my situation. If i applied to build a house they would happily give it to me. There is no problem there. I refuse to fill in their forms... A contract.. And pay money and then more money for building warrants and become subject to all the regulations for something i do not need consent for provided i do not break common law by harming public amenity. Bottom line is... Building withoit pp is not a crime or unlawful or even illegal by their own laws under the planning acts. Planning is a statuatory function, with powers conferred upon planning authorities and the sos by statute and exercised for the public benefit. Therefore, planning decisions are prime examples of decisions which are susceptible to judicial review under the common law jurisdiction. Therefore, provided you are not harming public amenity there is little they can do. But, the catch is.... Is you need to know this and let them know you know this. So, now you can see how the human rights is a mere afterthought in my argument.
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Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby flora » Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:08 am

btw.. Would be interested to hear your human rights case. Were you served an enf. Notice and did you use human rights as an argument in an appeal?
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Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby huntingross » Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:11 am

So if i'm reading this right, the only impediment in your mind to the allodial title the Land Registry call it, and the TRUE allodial title you're seeking..........is a Statute......so haven't you answered your own question.

Bearing in mind the Land Registry are held to be 'authoritive' on this subject.

Yes, when they came to enforce the Notices....we went to court on the basis of human rights....it was watertight in my mind....there is no public or national imperitative that gave the LA the right or need to over rule our rights...but the court decided that the planning legislation is harmonious with the human rights blah blah...and we were evicted from our own land.
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Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby flora » Sat Jul 18, 2009 12:06 pm

no, i don't believe there is anything there i could competently make work in my case.....yet. I take it you did not appeal your enforcement notice? If you did not but then launched a human rights case against them you lost from the word go. By launching a human rights case you tacitly consented to the enforcement action conferred under the planning act by establishing your locus standi or standing therefore, for your case to have even of had a chance you would have had to exhausted all other methods of defence namely, appeal to sos and then if lost to the court of session on a point of law ie. Human rights and only then could you have launched seperate proceedings under section 7(1) of the hra 1998. Even then you would have had to argue human rights in your initial appeal of the notice to the sos to have had any chance at all. Which will explain why you were told human rights is harmonious with planning statute. If you did not exhaust the methods i describe the judge only really has jurisdiction to decide if the actual planning laws and hence the enforcement procedure conferred by the law is compatible with human rigjts legislation and not to how it was applied to you in your case specifically. See neil collars book, planning and human rights.
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Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby huntingross » Sat Jul 18, 2009 12:21 pm

I dont want to turn this into a thread of planning enforcement. I know how to appeal planning decisions, I know the recourse to that is the Court of Session on legal technicalities only. Have you ever met anyone that can finance an appeal through the Court of Session....it is a tool designed to prevent justice being done by the depth of your pockets...access to it is not equal for all.

If you want to pursue this line, please start a thread and I will join it.
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Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby flora » Sat Jul 18, 2009 12:51 pm

well, it would appear that the subjects of allodial title and enforcement action go hand in hand. What use is an allodial title if nobody can establish how it can circumvent the statutes that control the use of the land, buildings and fixtures upon the land?? Establishing this for competent practice is obviously paramount. This is the question i pose.
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Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby huntingross » Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:00 pm

Then I suggest you pose it with someone you believe can answer it, for you seemingly do not think that is me.

I have read the Act, it seems pretty clear to me, I have the answer from the Land Registry in unequivocable terms.

I am prepared to put my house where my land is and will let you know.

What ever it is you are trying to do on your croft, I wish you luck.
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Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby flora » Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:54 am

which act? Abolition of feudal tenure? The reason i'm not convinced is the fact that land must be registered in the land registry. Or maybe it doesn't?? Registration = giving it away as far as i can make out so, the fact that the land registry are now giving titles a pretty name doesn't convince me. Ie. They call my title an allodial title but, i still have burdens as do most. So far you've made oit that you can buy "corners of farmers fields" and magically dissolve burdens then register them with the land registry as such. So, no i'm not convinced and I wasn't specifically addressing you.. I'm querying any member of this forum.
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Re: Allodial Title is Real

Postby huntingross » Mon Jul 20, 2009 12:23 pm

For example I have de-registered my car, my new details are still recorded there.

The history of the Land Registry was to "Record" title claims....I believe that is their sole purpose.

You say Registration = giving it away....how do you know that...you read it somewhere...go check that out and bring your findings back to the forum....lets see if it stands up to scrutiny.

So far you've made oit that you can buy "corners of farmers fields" and magically dissolve burdens then register them with the land registry


If you can find where I have said that, I'll be very surprised. Don't lay your issues on top of what I'm saying. Don't come onto my thread and start baiting me. Start your own thread.

If a field has a pre-existent burden on it that has not been discharged, then it might not be possible to make it allodial....there is no magic involved....

You seem to have an issue about something, I'm non the wiser what it is, if its the Land Registry....send them an FOI and challenge them.

They have not given your property an allodial title....it can only be allodial if there are no burdens or debt....if you are free of those, you have allodial title.

I have no burdens or debt on my land....FACT...i have allodial title...

If I got a secured debt, I would no longer have that title.
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