12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Wow I'm on Fire Tonight Folks

Postby steve2577 » Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:47 am

When I posted my American Expres APPLICATION form on the thread I folded the first page as it related to private information about myself in effect it was your usual APPLICATION for credit card form APPLICATION APPLICATION APPLICATION APPLICATION form (sorry about that I keep shouting the word APPLICATION form). the bottom half of the APPLICATION form had a sort of company stamp and squigly thing on it so I thought this was the bit everyboy would want to see but the really important bit was at the top where it said in big chumky letters the word APPLICATION form.

On the letter Amex sent me it even said

"Please find enclosed a copy of the original Application and terms and conditions for the abov account. These documents form the executed agreement between you and American Express. Please see statements we have sent you previously to validate the debt held"

This is the link where I got the following paragraph from http://thecca.blogspot.com/

This is why it is imperative to establish if the creditor has access to the original document. The older the account is the less likely it is that the creditor has the original document. Even if they do it has to be in the correct format. Any alleged agreement that states it is an application anywhere on the document cannot be enforced. Think about it – thousands of people apply for credit cards and loans every day and not all of those are approved. If every application were deemed to be an actual enforceable agreement then you could have lots of dubious claims being made against people for nonexistent debts.

Now again you all might know about this but somebody might benefit from the info if I am right and its quite late so I could be very wrong then.

Please somebody confirm the above and I will then need a load of lemons to wipe the smile from my face if I meet the bastards in court.




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Re: 12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Postby kevin » Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:04 am

Here's a new twist I've just thought of eating breakfast (don't worry...I'm off up the mountains for the afternoon now)

If you have a contract with someone, signed by both parties, then one enters new terms and conditions, this renders the contract void as it's no longer the contract you signed. ....so....what happens when they change the interest rates?
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Re: 12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Postby BaldBeardyDude » Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:17 am

kevin wrote:Here's a new twist I've just thought of eating breakfast (don't worry...I'm off up the mountains for the afternoon now)

If you have a contract with someone, signed by both parties, then one enters new terms and conditions, this renders the contract void as it's no longer the contract you signed. ....so....what happens when they change the interest rates?


Exactly - what about variable rates? - that would immediately void the contract.
They must find it hard to take Truth for authority who have so long mistaken Authority for Truth - Gerald Massey
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Re: 12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Postby steve2577 » Sun Nov 22, 2009 11:10 pm

When I posted my first letter there wasnt any mention of CCA 1974 etc and I think I need to post a more formal request quoting CCA 1974 and include the £1 fee so I then get a response which I can act on in terms of moving it into Dispute and challenging anything that is received.

I received from Amex a dubious agreement with the word Application in bold letters on the Application form, and there wasnt any signature by them also it seemed to be a digitised copy.

So I have prepared this letter

AMEX Second Letter uploaded to FMOTL.doc


Tesco sent me an apology about not being able to find any agreement of mine

So I have prepared this letter

Tesco Second Letter uploaded to FMOTL site.doc


Capital One wanted something with a Signature on it

So I have prepared this letter

Capital One Second Letter uploaded to FMOTL.doc



Advice please?
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Last edited by steve2577 on Mon Nov 23, 2009 3:00 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: 12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Postby kevin » Sun Nov 22, 2009 11:34 pm

stick something like "Notice of formal request" at the top to make it a notice

with a true copy of any account


contract or agreement rather than account, otherwise it's fine

1st letter...amex

corners of the document and
original document


cap one..don't forget...don't sign it, it's a habit hard to break sometimes.


now get them sent off
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Re: 12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Postby steve2577 » Tue Nov 24, 2009 11:58 am

Update on Tesco

I inititally thought that because Tesco couldn't find any contract that would at least hold things up however

First Response fom Tesco

Image


Second and third response from Tesco

Image

Image

Any advice would be great
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Re: 12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Postby kevin » Tue Nov 24, 2009 1:19 pm

Well politely tell them to piss off, can they show you where it say's about these charges on your agreement that they refer to?

If you are in breach of your agreement


how the flip would they know...they haven't got it. tell them you dispute any debt exists, you've asked to see the agreement, they've admitted they haven't got one, your not paying them anything without seeing it as you don't believe it exists, statements are not evidence of anything, add a fee schedule for future unsubstantiated claims made against you

tell them to take the £12 from the tea kitty
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Re: 12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Postby Pleasuredome » Tue Nov 24, 2009 1:40 pm

notice, they say "your" agreement and not "our" agreement. again i ask, to whom is the money owed?

from what i've heard, the courts are now accepting copies of the original signed agreement (this is not lawful in my opinion, but the courts are in bed with the service providers, as we know). up to now, most service providers havent been keeping a copy of the original that they sell on, so when they are asked for it, they become stuck. now you'll find that they will always make a copy before selling it. this will make the act of asking for a copy pointless.
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Re: 12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Postby steve2577 » Tue Nov 24, 2009 2:27 pm

I really do appreciate any reply and personally I would like to bend the guy who runs tesco over a table and stick the credit card statements where the sun dont shine but getting a pile of letters everyday is not easy to deal with.

I really really want to send a letter with some of the comments suggested but where does that actually get me if I end up in court in a few weeks or months and a judge reads what I have said would he laugh and think at last somebody has the nerve to speak his mind or would I get shafted by the courts and made bankrupt

I have drafted the following letter and sent this yesterday

On the 29th Oct 2009 I sent a letter requesting information regarding the above agreement.

Your reply to my request dated 4th Nov 2009 was totally unsatisfactory in that you failed to supply me with any of the information I asked for therefore. I am now making a formal request pursuant to sections 77/78 of the CCCA 1974.

I require you to provide me with a true copy of any agreement you deem to be mine together with any other documentation the Consumer Credit Act 1974 requires you to provide. I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit (12 + 2 days).

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee and then remove any incorrect entries from your systems.

I enclose a postal order in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

As you did not comply with my initial request for information dated 29th Oct 2009 I now consider this matter to be in DISPUTE and you should be aware that a creditor is not permitted to take ANY action whilst it remains in dispute.

The lack of a compliant credit agreement is a very clear dispute and as such the following applies.

* may not demand any payment on the agreement, nor am I obliged to offer any payment to you.
* may not add further interest or any charges to the agreement.
* may not pass the agreement to a third party.
* may not register any information in respect of the agreement with any credit reference agency.
* may not issue a default notice related to the agreement.


In Sincerity and Honour
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Re: 12 Notices sent and various replies received any suggestions

Postby steve2577 » Tue Nov 24, 2009 4:04 pm

Could somebody give me a link for a letter to send to a DCA



Thanks
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